Not having cross-over games would be fine, since most (if not all) of our crossover games are played against Suburban league teams anyway.

If they wanted to keep a Lower Bucks Division of the Suburban league, that would be fine, as long as at least 2 teams (i.e. CRN and CRS) were willing to be part of the lower bucks division. They could have 2, 4 team divisions and 1, 5 team division.

I know that this has been discussed in the past and was even discussed this year, but neither league wanted to relinquish power and it never got anywhere.

It is a shame, becuase the hockey would be very competitive and it would finally give Neshaminy and Pennsbury a fair shot at winning a league championship (not that I am saying that they would win, becuase the suburban AA is a tough league).

That would also make for a hypothetical seven already existing AAA teams in the combined league.

Roman
Judge
Ryan
GA
Ghost
LaSalle
Wood

If they each played the normal AAA schedule of 12 games, then played each other one more time....that would equal 18 games (A nice season) with up to six possible games to play against traditional rivalries, IE: Wood vs Tennent or Abington, Ghost vs Pennsbury or Neshaminy....etc.

That all sounds good but you forget one thing, schools like Roman, Judge, and Ryan in the city have an advantage over Wood, McDevitt and Pius, there are no Phila Public schools w/ high school hockey, if you want to play HS hockey and live in the city, you go to one of the schools mentioned above or to LaSalle, HGP or GA (if mom & dad can afford it).

Sure they can get players from many areas, but don't you think if recruiting was "easy" for them, you would think McDevitt would have found a goalie from somewhere and not have to convert a forward this past season. What did Pius have on the roster - 12 players?????
Forcing teams like that to play AAA would just result in them having to drop their teams.

I didnt say anything about Pius or McDevitt playing AAA. That's a completely different subject than the SHSHL and LBCSHL possibly combining.

I would be interested in a four league setup. West, East, North and South. CPIHL is already a very big league (37 teams) and would be the West. ICSHL and Eastern would combine to form the South, SJ would be east and LV, Suburban and Lower Bucks would be North. Divisional alignments within the North and South could maintain traditional League alignments.

I think it's a great idea. I for one would like to see ONE high school league in Eastern PA, and with this consolidation, it would be the first step towards that.

I have spoken to Ken Haas as well as you (Don) about this.
Kenny is willing to drop the name SHSHL, combine the leagues and start from scratch with a new league name. This way it doesnt appear that any of the leagues "folded" or that the SHSHL is on a "power trip".....I think its a great idea!

So if Suburban was willing to combine leagues this year what happened? I know that they had 2 meetings and that it was voted down?

I know a lot of the players and coaches would like to see the leagues combined, why is it such a hard thing to get done?

If we are keeping leagues together becuase of "tradition" then that is crazy! The LBCSHL has seen a lot of change in the past 2-3 season whith Bensalem and Truman dropping out, CEC struggling to field a team and Roman joining.

However, if we did combine leagues I would suggest that it be a pure AA league with no varsity 2 teams and public schools only.

Private schools should play AAA (regardles of talent) and if a team wants to field 2 (or more) varsity teams then the extra teams should play a club schedule. No other sport allows 2 varsity teams, why should hockey?

quote:

So if Suburban was willing to combine leagues this year what happened? I know that they had 2 meetings and that it was voted down?

I wasnt part of the meetings or the vote. Someone from the inside would have to comment on that.

The whole idea of breaking school by size also doesnt hold much weight cause to be honest it is also demographics. Coatseville which is 15 minutes from West Chester has over 900 students and no varsity hockey team any more. It is a predominantly black area and not as wealthy as the surrounding Chester county of West Chester and Downingtown whose schools are smaller. Because of the price of hockey it makes it very hard to divide each year. How it should be done is that every year there are several criteria the committee looks at as to make the change year to year.

AAA: all private schools. If they want to request down to AA need reasoning and previous performance was inferior to rest of the league. If public school wants to play AAA needs to petition on grounds of demographics, finances, superior talent, previous success against AAA teams and dominance in AA.

AA: all larger schools over 750. If school wants to play down needs to petition on grounds of demographics, finances, or inferior talent in area and previous schedule.

A: smaller schools less then 750. If school wants to play up needs to petition on grounds of demographics, finances, or superior talent in area.

It may seem confusing but lets be honest some teams can play up. Haverford High has was Flyers Cup AA 3 times and has played O Hara and Bonner beating them. Kennent an A team beat Malvern AAA. As to the rule of teams not having more than one varsity team eligible (Lasalle Blue and Gold AA) They should be able to play Flyers Cup because we do want best talent at the best levels.

The idea of combining the leagues is the best idea by far and would help strengthen rivalries and create new ones. Plus with combining leagues we consolidate the talent improving all teams involved. This will help push the state finals in our favor as we have more schools. As to break up

West: CPIHL
South: ICSHL
East: ESHL and SHSHL
North: LVSHL and LBCSHL

Each one would have almost 30 teams or more with teams in all levels. CPIHL and ICSHL have the most schools so can be by themselves. You can change the names to the divisions with Flyers Cup still being part of the playoffs. You would have AAA, AA, A at all divisions with playoffs having eventual champion of each division. You can then have a "Frozen Four" at each level which is the Flyers Cup with North playing South and East playing West. This would be great for fans and players combined and would lead to some great hockey and memorable games. Eventually we can maybe get some PIAA recognition to make this an official sport within the state so we can get public funding. With the funding we can strengthen the local school programs and maybe get some more schools involved. I know this is out there and looking long term, but this would be a neat set up for the future if done. Just a thought.

1- You forgot about South Jersey
Like it or not, they are a part of the Flyers Cup pool.

2- EHSHL should combine with the ICSHL, geograpically it is a better fit than the SHSHL.

Cubano, couple of thought provoking posts. You left South Jersey out, which we cannot do because the Flyers Cup tournament is a tool to promote ice hockey for the Philadelphia Flyers and South Jersey is part of their market.

I am not a fan of teams petitioning to move down and being eligible. I believe that if a team petitions down, they should be ineligible for the Flyers Cup.

I am also very adamant that second, third etc. teams from one school not be eligible. This was determined a few years ago because there are no guarantees that a school realizing it cannot win AAA could "sandbag" and stack their second team.

Matt beat me to the SJ point. I type slow

quote:

I am not a fan of teams petitioning to move down and being eligible. I believe that if a team petitions down, they should be ineligible for the Flyers Cup.

I agree.....I have no problem with a team that feels that they can't compete at AAA playing at AA, but they should not be eligible for Flyers Cup.

What should be done IMHO is an overhaul of the entire State HS hockey alignment. I have been meaning to jot down my mental proposal for a few weeks now and just havent found the time to do it. Hopefully I can get it down on "paper" this week.

Some very good ideas have been mentioned thus far